ford excursion 7.3 vs v10

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V10 to 7.3 swap. Help/ advice needed

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Hello! New member, new to diesels, but not new to these style forums. I’ve been running diesels since I was 18 for work, and have a general knowledge but have never had a personal diesel or had to deal with specific problems. For the last three years I’ve been running an 02 v10 crew cab long bed from California (I’m in the U.P. Of Michigan So rust is a BIG deal) A few months ago it bit the dust, blew up for no apparent reason. Always serviced with motor craft parts, 5w20 blah blah blah doesn’t matter cause I’m tired of the gas engine life. Anyway, it asploded, big time. I’m tired of the ticking time bomb of a gas engine in a 3/4-1 ton truck. I recently bought an 01 f350 with the 7.3 to do a swap. I’m already doing the regular for a high mileage 7.3, injectors, cups, glow plugs, relay, block heater etc. I’m looking for some specifics, the swap “mechanically “ is straight forward and I can handle it. It’s the fine details that make me scratch my brain. If anyone that has done the swap/ knows how to do it/ smarter than me(which is mostly anyone here) can chime in and lead me in the right direction, that would be greatly appreciated. As far as the wiring goes, I’m lost! Thanks anyone that can contribute! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro  

Swap everything over - cluster to electricals to fuel lines etc. you’ll know what to use and reuse and toss out. That’s all that I’ve read this far anyways. Easier to buy the diesel and fix it up and or swap your good seats over. Almost everything will swap and interchange body wise except engine and electronics. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk  

I realize it’s easier to swap out my good parts for the bad parts on the donor truck, but my truck is a cclb and mint, the donor truck is eclb and beeeeeeeaaattttt. Like beat, should be in the scrap yard beat lol. I know I have to swap everything over, just looking for first hand experiences, or good advice. Due to loan situations and stuff, this is where I’m at and what I need to do. Unfortunately. Edit: I’m not trying to come off c-o-c-k-y or anything, I’m honestly looking for first hand experience. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro  

O and I would move the entire pcm and idm in cab or in a better place where a leaky windshield won’t ruin it or a puddle short the idm out but that’s just me. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk  

boy your in for some fun, is the 01 odometer mechanical or digital if its mechanical the entire in cab harness is different since the digital one has a different cam-bus.  

alaskan155 said: boy your in for some fun, is the 01 odometer mechanical or digital if its mechanical the entire in cab harness is different since the digital one has a different cam-bus. Click to expand...

Over the years I've done about a half-dozen MAJOR swap/rebuild/resurrection projects. Mostly with GM vehicles, but I did "save" a 88 Ford Econoline Quadravan (Pathfinder 4X4 Conversion) by re-bodying it with a 1990 Econoline body. How different could they be? VERY. I ended up swapping all the wiring and cluster, etc from the 88 into the 90 body. Lot of work, but fairly straight forward. That van is still running and being enjoyed today. Do your research. Compare the two vehicles. The layout of fuel lines. Merasure where cross-members are. If something from the beater needs to be transferred to the good truck, and it's a crummy part, obtain a replacement part. Make notes, figure out exactly what you need and what needs to be changed. Get everything together in one place, block out the time, and work on it until you finish it. My experience has been if the swap isn't completed in about 4-6 weeks, it won't be completed in 4-5 years. Something about loosing interest, or not having the funds, etc. If it gets done quickly, it gets done and enjoyed. If there's no money, time, or parts are constantly on order or being waited upon, it won't get done. Factory Service Manuals are a great resource to figure out wiring and other differences between the two vehicles. I would figure out what it takes to swap the entire Diesel electrical system into the gasser. When I did my Econoline the hole in the firewall of the 90 was a different shape and size than the 88's. I had to make a patch panel to put the older harness through the newer body. These are the little things you need to find by inspection. Then start thinking about how to solve them before you actually begin the work. While the suggestion to relocate the ECM and IDM into the interior makes sense, it would be a TON of work, and require extending and rerouting about 75-100 individual wires. Unless you have extraordinarily GOOD wiring and electrical skills, such a relocation would probably be less reliable than just leaving the components where they have been for almost 20 years, working reliably in a few hundred thousand other trucks. Do your research. Get your funding in place. Get the parts lined up. Then get it done. Good Luck.  

Can't get much better than that, but yeah, pretty much plan on taking everything that's not a body piece over. The wire ports into the cab are likely to be different. I cut the ones out from the cab that came with the motor bigger than the ones I removed and siliconed/sheet metal screwed it together to seal it. Other than that, I didn't have any major issues I recall.  

Read my thread, I'm doing basically the same thing, putting a 7.3 wiring harness/dash/etc into a 5.4 gasser cab. At this point, the cab is stripped, I'll be using the cab wiring harness that is specifically for the cab/doors, and the diesel dash/wiring/frame plumbing/fuel tank/etc. http://www.powerstroke.org/forum/po...ed-crew-cab-superduperduty-family-hauler.html I havent made any progress in 4 months, but I can tell you it looks easy enough, the cut-outs in the firewall look the same... Good luck on your project, please share it with us.  

I'm doing a similar project.. My truck is a 01 F250 V10 2wd with great original paint and body from Idaho, donor truck is a 01 F350 7.3 ZF6 4x4 so i'm swapping everything over. I pulled complete dash out of the 7.3 truck and will swap that into gasser along with under hood harness, fuel lines, radiator, intercooler, hydroboost and other related items.. swap everything, its not hard... I'm also doing 6 speed and 4x4 conversion.. These trucks are relalively easy..  

Im in a similar situation. I have an 02 Excursion with a 7.3 that was rear ended and is being totaled. a guy hit my rear driver side corner and stopped under my rear axel, breaking the centering bolt in the process. I'm think9ing about getting at 02 Excursion with a V10 and swapping bodies. Does anyone know if the bodies are the same? Obviously, I'll have to change all the computers and wiring under the dash, and from what I've been told I'll need to swap the pedal. I'm just seeing if anyone has done this or if anyone knows if the bodies are the same. I'd think that they are, since it wouldn't make any sense to change the bodies just for a different motor, but again, This Is Ford. Love them, but they do some questionable ****.  

you are gonna need a new gauge cluster your gonna need a tcu a ecu you're gonna have to swap electronics fuel pumps and lines i don´t know the specifics but it will be a hard job also i would check the drivetrain to make sure the diffs and axles and suspension are in good shape just be careful  

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Does anyone have any input on the 1999 V10 Good or Bad? I have a 2001 7.3 and im thinking of buying a 1999 V10 and i was wondering if anyone had and type of input as far as mileage or how the V10 tow's compared to the 7.3 or anything else yall may want to add  

buddys uncle has one he has a little trailer one tank 7.2 mpg average:doh:  

Since your in Mi listen to it run for a hissing shound. Chances are the manifold has a crack on it, most V10s I see have it. Personally I'd stick with a Diesel.  

Say good bye to gas mileage. My dad had a v10 when I was younger and it had 35s with little lift and got 9 in the city.:doh: Besides that I have never owned one.  

The bad things about 99 v10s are bad oil pumps:doh:. And the very restrictive manifold(that crack) and Y pipe. And the 99's are only 235HP You are prob better of w a 00(265hp) or newer to get away from the oil pump issue. But they still have the restrictive manifolds and Y pipe. If you go 05 0r newer(365hp) they run like a scolded dog and are very reliable. for power for towing they do pretty good.(05 and newer) Depends on what you tow and how often. I'm sure someone is going to yell at me for this but a stock(o5 and newer) will smoke a stock 7.3 Newest v10s can get as high as 15 mpg(highway) Which isnt too bad when you think about the power and when gas is at least $1.00 a gallon less than diesel  

If you don't plan on doing alot of heavy pulling then they're ok, but if your thinking of buying this for a tow rig, you need to get a diesel.  

Yeah, there were more V-10's installed in C-class motor homes then all other engines from all 3 auto companies combined. The V-10 is one tough engine that tows just fine. Yes, the 99 had a few problems, mostly with restrictive exhaust/Y-pipe and blowing spark plugs. That was fixed totally in 2002 and the HP was upped to a 365 in 2006 to present. With adding the new Ford Torqueshift tranny, the V-10 is tough to beat when matched with the right rear end ratio. It will give the new diesels a run for their money and beat most of them. In the Truck Trend mag a few months ago, where they tested all 3 auto maker diesels and all 3 gassers, the Ford V-10 was rated the best gasser and the comment was "it is as close to being a diesel rig as any gasser could be."  

all these mentions of other year engines have no merit in this thread. the v10 the OP is looking at is a dog, and will never compare to a 7.3. stick with diesel bro. biggest mistake our FD ever made was buying a v10...  

I owned a 99 I did an intake and exhaust It had a 5-speed as well It wasn't bad on gas 15-17 at 65mph. But I went back to the ol' 460 that would run this truck into the ground with similar mods at 10 mpg though. But I fell in love with my 7.3 when I test drove and sent the 460 down the road. Needless to say the 7.3 would stomp the V10 LOADED or EMPTY.  

thanks everyone for yr replies and thanks slowleak for pointing out the yr i was looking at, the only reason that yr is important is i was concerding trading my 7.3 for a 99 V10 and i dont know sh1t about them...I hate to get rid of my diesel but fuel prices have got me so frustraded...... and my 7.3 mpg sucks..........  

A good tune and a air intake should up your milage quit a bit. Dad's 01 (4x4 ext cab 8' bed 6 speed 3.73 gear) gets around 19-21 mpg running @75mph. That truck is similar to yours so your results will probably be similar. Real trucks dont have sparkplugs!  

You dont want a v10 no matter what year the mileage sucks. My old employer had a 99 got 10 mpg highway on average. My buddy just got an 07 10.2 mpg is the best hes gotten out of it so far and thats babying it  

I did the math a couple weeks ago towing 7k at 60-65 i got 10mpg And then again on a tank without towing anything 75%highway and 25%city And got 11.. Ive had this truck since new and its running fine great power just no mps's  

The wife has a 2000 lifted excursion w/ headers , some air intake upgrade,throttle body . 3.73 LS rears. When she wanted one I brought home several 7.3 's from the local dealer , finally she went with me and she jumped in the gasser tromped on it and that is the one she had to have (i think it was the color). Nope , she dont tow , dont really haul heavy , but she can take a half a dozen kids snow boarding and stop at super wal-mart on the way home and still have room. When we drive on vacation I get the chance to run it and I like it .  

What's yr V10 mpg pappy?  

It's a 2008, Supercab, shortbed, 4.10 rear, automatic, V-10. I get an average during the summer, of 11.6 around town and going from my house to Boise which is 50 miles of curves and hills. Towing heavy, I have never gotten below 9.0 and seems to hover around 9.5 no matter what the terrain is. I have added the Diablosport Predator and have it set on the middle, 91 octane position, and added the Air Raid intake system. A total of $600 in mods. I have had this setup for almost all of my 30k on the truck. Runs like a top and I wouldn't change anything.  

I just based this off of all the trucks I've had. 1997 cclb 80horse chip and 3 inch dp, picked up 1.5 mpg. 2001 dodge ram 3500 4x4 6 speed 11,500pds 4.10 gears edge box avg 20.8mpg stock mpg 15. 1996 cclb 4x4 35's, 530 hybrids big oil trans air intake fuel system 3.55 gears 19.5 mpg stock 15. I guess I should have said "results will vary":doh:  

My uncle just bought a 2008 CC short bed V-10 with 4.10 rear about 2 weeks ago. he just took a 400 mile hunting trip out to iowa and he averaged about 12.0mpg. havnt had it long enough to tow anything around the farm yet.  

If you're only getting 12 or 13 mpg out of a SRW 7.3 then you have something wrong with it. My truck in sig on a bad day will get 17mpg(with a strong headwind). Normally I am in the 19-20mpg range. I have on occasion achieved 23.5 mpg while babying it a lot. Fathers 99 7.3 gets 19mpg all day long @ 75mph with 305,000 miles on it. Brothers stock 2004 6.0 gets 18-20 no matter how you drive it. Nobody that I know with a 7.3 gets below 17mpg unless they are towing really heavy or hot rodding around. A V10 can't touch a properly running diesel in the mpg department. I agree the new V10's make good power, but I haven't seen one yet that's turning out almost 700 lb ft of torque and still get 20mpg like my 12 year old truck does.  

And comparing fuel prices, i'm sorry but $1.79 per gallon @ 11mpg costs a lot more than $2.23 per gallon @ 20mpg... (current fuel prices here)  

We run a fleet of v-10's where i work (my boss is a retard) and all of them live under 24-32 foot flatbed gooseneck trailers. We never haul less than 15,000lb and in my opinion they suck. They will run 70-80 on the flats but as soon as you hit a hill you better get out and help push. Our mileage runs between 4.2 and 5.8. I've offered to race my boss pulling ( did I mention he's a retard) with my 96 psd but he wont take me up on it. Oh ya and at 100,000 plan on a new motor. The best i've seen so far as about 113,000 before they blow. I know first hand, I'm workin on blowin up my third one rite now.  

Well maybe your boss is a retard depending on the way he has his V-10's set up. If you all are hauling what you say, then he should have adjusted the rearend ratio to make up the difference. If you look at all of the motor homes and C class vehicles with V-10's and look at the number of complaints versus the number of diesel engine complaints, there is no comparison, the diesel engines are dead last for TSB's. Yes, my 2002 7.3 hopped up to the max would consistantly get 16-18 mpg depending on my foot, no argument there. And, that 7.3 had plenty of poop, I'd guess close to 400 hp when I sold it. BUT, when you look at an occasional tower, even at max, and include the difference in fuel cost and maintenance issues, the new V-10 is one hell of an engine to do most anything it is asked to do. I would not change my decision to order my 2008 from a 6.4 diesel to a V-10 gasser, as my "gas and go" is a real winner.  

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2002 Ford Excursion Review

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Edmunds' Expert Review

• Provides safe haven for the family, carries lots of stuff, truck-tough underpinnings can take lots of abuse.
• Won't fit in a standard garage, drives like a loaded U-Haul, horrific fuel economy, hard to park, can't beat the Suburban at its own game.

Excursions get crystalline headlamp lenses for 2002, as well as "smart" intermittent front and rear wipers. XLTs gain a new auto-lock feature as well as standard third-row child seat tethers with a BeltMinder system. Excursion Limited receives a chrome side strip, automatic climate control and power-adjustable pedals. New options on XLT include power-adjustable pedals and a power front passenger seat. Limited models can be equipped with memory seats and pedals, second-row captain's chairs and redundant controls for climate and audio on the steering wheel. Both XLT and Limited will get a DVD-based entertainment system for rear-seat passengers later this year. Skid plates are no longer optional.

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Too much truck for too many people. Buy a Suburban if you need a nine-passenger SUV that can tow.

Cost to Drive Cost to drive estimates for the 2002 Ford Excursion XLT 2WD 4dr SUV (5.4L 8cyl 4A) and comparison vehicles are based on 15,000 miles per year (with a mix of 55% city and 45% highway driving) and energy estimates of N/A undefined in North Dakota.

Vehicle overview.

In a classic "bigger is better" move, Ford has upped the SUV ante by producing the largest Bradymobile yet. The Excursion offers more interior room and cargo capacity than the previous heavyweight title-holder, the Chevrolet Suburban. At the same time, Ford is touting the Excursion's "earth-friendly" aspects like an engine lineup that meets LEV standards (albeit for heavy-duty trucks, not passenger cars and light-duty trucks) and the fact that 85 percent of the Excursion, by weight, is recyclable (never mind that 85 percent of an Excursion still equals about 2.5 Honda Civics).

The Excursion's base engine is a 5.4-liter V8 (255 hp/350 pound-feet) on two-wheel-drive models or a 6.8-liter V10 (310 hp/425 lb-ft) on models equipped with four-wheel drive. Optional is a 7.3-liter V8 diesel that makes 250 horsepower and 505 lb-ft of earth-shaking torque. All engines come with a four-speed automatic transmission as standard equipment; no manual transmission is offered in the Excursion.

A trailer tow hitch comes standard, and the Excursion can tug 11,000 pounds in 4WD guise. For comparison, the Chevy Suburban 2500 equipped with the 8.0-liter Vortec V8 can manage 12,000 pounds. But the Ford holds slightly more cubic feet of stuff than the Chevy. The Excursion measures 146.4 cubic feet versus the Suburban's 138.4.

Two trim levels are available. The base XLT model includes running boards, remote keyless entry, four-wheel disc brakes with ABS, an AM/FM/cassette/CD stereo, a 40/20/40 split-bench front seat and a third-row removable bench seat. Angle up to the Limited trim level, and you get a leather interior, automatic climate control, front captain's chairs, woodgrain trim, rear-seat audio controls, a trip computer, power rear quarter-windows, aluminum wheels, illuminated running boards, power signal aero mirrors and fog lamps. An optional rear seat entertainment system, which includes a 6.4-inch overhead LCD monitor, is DVD-powered this year.

Buy an Excursion, and you get tons of cargo- and passenger-carrying capacity, plus the security of knowing that no one else on the road will try to mess with you. Of course, you also get the huge inconvenience of not being able to park in certain garages or use some car wash facilities, and then there's the possibility that other people will assume that, by driving such a behemoth, you're trying to overcompensate for some other area in which you may be lacking. But if you're in the market for such a vehicle, and neither the Chevy Suburban nor the GMC Yukon XL does it for you size-wise, this is your SUV.

Just keep in mind that driving the Excursion is like piloting a loaded U-Haul, and you're going to have to become an ultra-safety-conscious driver.

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6.0 vs 7.3 vs V10

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am looking at an Excursion and cant decide what engine to get, a new V10, a 6.0 diesel, or a used 7.3 diesel. My best freind has the 7.3 in his truck and loves it. My brother has the 6.0 in his truck and it is sweet, smooth, powerful, and I love the 5 speed auto but am worried about the problems with the injectors, computer flashes, reliability, and longevity. I've considered the V10 which is cheaper and maybe adding a supercharger (which puts the cost up to where a diesil would be). I have spent time searching but cant figure out what keywords to search to find the latest lowdown on the 6.0 and whether it has been worked out satisfactorily. Help?  

6.0 hands down, no comparison. V-10 will suck the gas, which is doing nothing but getting more expensive, and the venerable 7.3 is not in the same class as the 6.0(I've had both)  

get the 6.0, there are a lot more good ones than bad ones out there. when i first came to this forum i was getting worried because of all the problems i was reading about. but if you step back and take a good look at these forums the people on here probably don't even make up 1% of 6.0 owners. my buddy is asst serivce mgr for ford and i allways ask him about problems i see in this forum and most of them he has not seen and this delear sells alot of diesels. so get the 6.0 and don't visit this site to often or you will never sleep at night.  

6.0L I could be wrong but I don't think that Ford offers the 7.3L anymore due to the another wonderful agency call the epa who rates right up there along with Dvm. By the way what are spark plugs???? Skee  

6.0L, but then again I'm biased. V-10 is a sweet engine, but it will suck the gas, especially with a blower. Also, I don't know if Ford has fixed the problem with the V-10, but they have been known to spit out a spark plug, threads and all, from time to time.  

Yep, 6.0, the only way to go! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif  

6.0! I have had nothing but grins during my 11k miles.  

6.0 without a doubt /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif  

I agree with Muncchie. After I bought my PSD, I found this forumn to educate myself s little more. Its a great forumn, but it can scare a person too. My 6.0 is great. I recommend it. Remeber that there is always going to be some lemons, no matter what brand you buy.  

[ QUOTE ] Also, I don't know if Ford has fixed the problem with the V-10, but they have been known to spit out a spark plug, threads and all, from time to time. [/ QUOTE ] Yes, they fixed that. There were only 3-4 threads in the heads for the spark plugs, so the engine likes to spit them out. Ford thickened the head a little so there are more threads (I forget how many, 6-7?). They don't spit out any more. Don't forget, the 2005 V-10 gets the 3v treatment and a lot more HP and torque. It also gets the TorqShift. Someone needs to ask how much you want to spend. A good used '02-'03 7.3 will cost 60%-70% of a new '04 with the 6.0. I have no doubt that the 6.0 is a better engine than the 7.3, but my 7.3 runs greeeeat. So did my '99 7.3. Does everything that I ask it to. I admit, I don't haul a 15,000 lbs. trailer over Mt. Kilamajaro, so maybe that is why the 7.3 is good enough for me. Pulling 7000 lbs. through the very rolling hills of northern Tennessee and southern Kentucky, it downshifted into 3rd maybe 3 times in 5 hours. Never got above 2700-2800 rpm. Driving around town, running errands, my 7.3 has no trouble keeping up with traffic. I can even leave a few people behind at the stoplight. Even pulling a 7500 lbs. trailer in city traffic, stopping is more of the problem than keeping up. I can't go too fast because I need to be able to stop at the next light. As far as trying to get a "quiet" diesel, yes, my 7.3 is loud, but not objectionably so. I also expect a diesel to clatter and growl a little. My 7.3 has a very impressive diesel sound. Makes gassers envious.  

in almost any case the diesel is the only way to go. how much driving do you do?? how long do you plan to keep the truck?? in some instances, if you drive less, and tow almost nothing, the gas may be better for you. the diesel is 5k more from the start and even at todays prices it would take you about 50 to 60k miles to just break even on the cost of the engine. diesels are very stronge and very durable, i would not own a gas as my main truck, but thats me for what i do. now resale plays a good part in the market too, you will get a little more for diesel than a gas on resale side. but in an excursion, many of the people that buy that truck/car, do not want a diesel. i tried to get my sister to get one, but she went for the gas. she is a lead foot soccer mom, gets about 9mpg around town in chicago. she probably could get 10.5 if wasn't for that foot. on the hwy they say they get 12, i would have not tought it was that good, cuase i only get 16, sometimes 17 if its cooler and less wind when i am empty. the diesel is a better engine, but do you need it?? and as far as i have heard, no excursions for 05. not sure but thats what i heard, good luck, BILL  

[ QUOTE ] As far as trying to get a "quiet" diesel, yes, my 7.3 is loud, but not objectionably so. I also expect a diesel to clatter and growl a little. My 7.3 has a very impressive diesel sound. Makes gassers envious. [/ QUOTE ] Although I like my 6.0 , I do like the sound of the 7.3.  

When you hear people complaining, most of the time it is "nit-picking" rather than being dissatisfied with their purchase. Don't forget, this is a board for people who are mainly looking to solve problems and or make improvements. People like to complain more than they like to praise. The 6.0 is a great engine. Yeah, there were some issues with the first batch in the first year, but most of that has been corrected or is "known." I love my 7.3L...but I think that the difference in factory horsepower between the 7.3 and 6.0 is almost 100hp! I doubt you will be disappointed with a 6.0 because it's got a lot of get-up-and-go!  

One other thing to consider. You are asking your question on a predominately diesel site! Drive all three and see what you like. I love my X w/7.3 and I loved my f250 w/7.3. Great motor. Proven reliability. ...danny  

If you are willing to get a used 7.3 then do that. It will save you a lot of money! Think how much extra fuel you can buy for $15,000 to $20,000 dollars.  

I've had 4 7.3's (still have 1) and 2 6.0's (still have both). The 6.0's have never let me down, and I only had one instance with the 7.3's (a CPS). All-in-all, the 6.0 is the best engine I've ever had. So, my vote is for the 6.0 Anyone want a 7.3? I need another 6.0  

I had an F350 Crew Cab V10... sucked gas and was slow with weight on the hitch.. the 6.0 is SO much better!!! damn near 75% more gas mileage, and it pulls up hill 3 times better...  

Lots of feedback. Thanks. It seems like most prefer the 6.0. It would be our main family car. We travel quite a bit with the kids. I also tow a heavy camper trailer hauler quite a bit. With the trailer, 100 galons of water, three four wheelers, and all our gear the trailer can reach 8000-9000 pounds. It takes everything my Expedition can do to tow, and often spend most of my time in second gear, (cant be good for the Exp.) It Utah, we have lots of hills and not a lot of flat areas. As for how long will I keep it, can't say. Usually keep until I find something I like more. I don't see much to compete with the Excursion in the near future (unless Chevy puts a diesel in the suburban. But I kind of partial against GM) Thanks  

I just sold my 5.4L Expedition as well. I have used and abused it for the past 3 years as an every day work vehicle, family & boat towing vehicle. It did pretty good all things considered, but it wasn't heavy duty enough for me to feel safe towing my boat with my newly born son in it. It also got terrible gas mileage because like you said I towed out of OD. I did a lot of looking and finally decided I was going get a pre-owned Excursion with the 7.3L PSD. If I had extra money to blow I would probably have gotten the 6.0L PSD. The stickers here in the STL area for a new 6.0L X is around $48,000 - $55,000 OUCH!!! I have many hobbies like boating, and a new baby so money is an issue...so I waited and found a 2000 X Limited 4X4 with 78,XXX loaded with flip down DVD, oversized tires, etc. for $21,900. To me this was the logical choice paying less than 1/2 of what a new one is going for. I now feel much safer towing and it gets much better fuel mileage. Also, I've known many people who have had or still have the 7.3L PSD and got mega miles out of them with no problems. You need to figure out what you're willing to spend on a payment and insurance...personally I like to have extra money for other activities. Just my $0.02. Good Luck!  

[ QUOTE ] ....I've known many people who have had or still have the 7.3L PSD and got mega miles out of them with no problems. [/ QUOTE ] Don't forget, you're talking DIESEL! These engines will go 500,000 easily if taken care of. I agree with a post earlier, if you can find a 7.3L significantly cheaper than a new 6.0...that's the way to go. However, the 7.3L holds its value very well, so sometimes the savings isn't huge. For $300 you can put 4-position chip on a 7.3L and it will SCREAM.  

All we've had is the 7.3's and have been nothing but very satisfied with it's performance. The 6.0's have a sound all of their own,a little cramped in the engine compartment for me but that's what the dealer is for /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Did you get the wife a new Diesel Excursion there Lawdog?  

With your towing load, one of the diesels would be ideal. They would hardly ever shift out of OD, and will never need to run in 2nd, even in Utah. I have a 7.3, but am envious of the speed and smoothness of the 6.0. As a daily driver the 6.0 is smoother and quieter inside (outside they are both a little noisy still, with their own distinct sounds). You will beat your Expy mileage in any driving conditions, and the braking and stability are much better. Wait for th egood year end deals on the Ex's, I've seen up to $10-11k off here in TX at the end of the model year.  

[ QUOTE ] am looking at an Excursion and cant decide what engine to get, a new V10, a 6.0 diesel, or a used 7.3 diesel. My best freind has the 7.3 in his truck and loves it. My brother has the 6.0 in his truck and it is sweet, smooth, powerful, and I love the 5 speed auto but am worried about the problems with the injectors, computer flashes, reliability, and longevity. I've considered the V10 which is cheaper and maybe adding a supercharger (which puts the cost up to where a diesil would be). I have spent time searching but cant figure out what keywords to search to find the latest lowdown on the 6.0 and whether it has been worked out satisfactorily. Help? [/ QUOTE ] If, and ONLY if you're independently wealthy, and don't give rat's butt about gasoline prices, the V10 might not be such a bad choice. I however, have driven a V10 and was totally underwhelmed. While it got off the line like being shot from a cannon, it quickly ran out of steam. I have never regretted my decision to go with the diesel, and when the mileage hits 300,000+ I'll probably be even happier.  

I think you'll be tickled pink with any diesel vs your 5.4. I traded up from a 5.4 E150 to my X because my E150 couldn't get out of second gear unless it was moving downhill (with my current trailer). The X tows the same load effortlessly. Pulling hills is now one of my favorite experiences. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif Have a good one, Dave  

Love the 7.3, both of them! Plan on drivin em into the ground. I want my money's worth! I would have never considered a 6.0 til seeing all the guy's that switched & feel the 6.0 is worth the upgrade. For now I'm staying, maybe the Tonka concept in 07' will get my money? Can't take it will ya! Dennis  

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The Comprehensive Guide to Moscow Nightlife

• Posted on April 14, 2018 July 26, 2018
• by Kings of Russia
• 8 minute read

Moscow’s nightlife scene is thriving, and arguably one of the best the world has to offer – top-notch Russian women, coupled with a never-ending list of venues, Moscow has a little bit of something for everyone’s taste. Moscow nightlife is not for the faint of heart – and if you’re coming, you better be ready to go Friday and Saturday night into the early morning.

This comprehensive guide to Moscow nightlife will run you through the nuts and bolts of all you need to know about Moscow’s nightclubs and give you a solid blueprint to operate with during your time in Moscow.

What you need to know before hitting Moscow nightclubs

Prices in moscow nightlife.

Before you head out and start gaming all the sexy Moscow girls , we have to talk money first. Bring plenty because in Moscow you can never bring a big enough bankroll. Remember, you’re the man so making a fuzz of not paying a drink here or there will not go down well.

Luckily most Moscow clubs don’t do cover fees. Some electro clubs will charge 15-20$, depending on their lineup. There’s the odd club with a minimum spend of 20-30$, which you’ll drop on drinks easily. By and large, you can scope out the venues for free, which is a big plus.

Bottle service is a great deal in Moscow. At top-tier clubs, it starts at 1,000$. That’ll go a long way with premium vodka at 250$, especially if you have three or four guys chipping in. Not to mention that it’s a massive status boost for getting girls, especially at high-end clubs.

Without bottle service, you should estimate a budget of 100-150$ per night. That is if you drink a lot and hit the top clubs with the hottest girls. Scale down for less alcohol and more basic places.

Dress code & Face control

Door policy in Moscow is called “face control” and it’s always the guy behind the two gorillas that gives the green light if you’re in or out.

In Moscow nightlife there’s only one rule when it comes to dress codes:

You can never be underdressed.

People dress A LOT sharper than, say, in the US and that goes for both sexes. For high-end clubs, you definitely want to roll with a sharp blazer and a pocket square, not to mention dress shoes in tip-top condition. Those are the minimum requirements to level the playing field vis a vis with other sharply dressed guys that have a lot more money than you do. Unless you plan to hit explicit electro or underground clubs, which have their own dress code, you are always on the money with that style.

Getting in a Moscow club isn’t as hard as it seems: dress sharp, speak English at the door and look like you’re in the mood to spend all that money that you supposedly have (even if you don’t). That will open almost any door in Moscow’s nightlife for you.

Types of Moscow Nightclubs

In Moscow there are four types of clubs with the accompanying female clientele:

High-end clubs:

These are often crossovers between restaurants and clubs with lots of tables and very little space to dance. Heavy accent on bottle service most of the time but you can work the room from the bar as well. The hottest and most expensive girls in Moscow go there. Bring deep pockets and lots of self-confidence and you have a shot at swooping them.

Regular Mid-level clubs:

They probably resemble more what you’re used to in a nightclub: big dancefloors, stages and more space to roam around. Bottle service will make you stand out more but you can also do well without. You can find all types of girls but most will be in the 6-8 range. Your targets should always be the girls drinking and ideally in pairs. It’s impossible not to swoop if your game is at least half-decent.

Basic clubs/dive bars:

Usually spots with very cheap booze and lax face control. If you’re dressed too sharp and speak no Russian, you might attract the wrong type of attention so be vigilant. If you know the local scene you can swoop 6s and 7s almost at will. Usually students and girls from the suburbs.

Electro/underground clubs:

Home of the hipsters and creatives. Parties there don’t mean meeting girls and getting drunk but doing pills and spacing out to the music. Lots of attractive hipster girls if that is your niche. That is its own scene with a different dress code as well.

What time to go out in Moscow

Moscow nightlife starts late. Don’t show up at bars and preparty spots before 11pm because you’ll feel fairly alone. Peak time is between 1am and 3am. That is also the time of Moscow nightlife’s biggest nuisance: concerts by artists you won’t know and who only distract your girls from drinking and being gamed. From 4am to 6am the regular clubs are emptying out but plenty of people, women included, still hit up one of the many afterparty clubs. Those last till well past 10am.

As far as days go: Fridays and Saturdays are peak days. Thursday is an OK day, all other days are fairly weak and you have to know the right venues.

The Ultimate Moscow Nightclub List

Short disclaimer: I didn’t add basic and electro clubs since you’re coming for the girls, not for the music. This list will give you more options than you’ll be able to handle on a weekend.

Preparty – start here at 11PM

Classic restaurant club with lots of tables and a smallish bar and dancefloor. Come here between 11pm and 12am when the concert is over and they start with the actual party. Even early in the night tons of sexy women here, who lean slightly older (25 and up).

The second floor of the Ugolek restaurant is an extra bar with dim lights and house music tunes. Very small and cozy with a slight hipster vibe but generally draws plenty of attractive women too. A bit slower vibe than Valenok.

Very cool, spread-out venue that has a modern library theme. Not always full with people but when it is, it’s brimming with top-tier women. Slow vibe here and better for grabbing contacts and moving on.

High-end: err on the side of being too early rather than too late because of face control.

Secret Room

Probably the top venue at the moment in Moscow . Very small but wildly popular club, which is crammed with tables but always packed. They do parties on Thursdays and Sundays as well. This club has a hip-hop/high-end theme, meaning most girls are gold diggers, IG models, and tattooed hip hop chicks. Very unfavorable logistics because there is almost no room no move inside the club but the party vibe makes it worth it. Strict face control.

Close to Secret Room and with a much more favorable and spacious three-part layout. This place attracts very hot women but also lots of ball busters and fakes that will leave you blue-balled. Come early because after 4am it starts getting empty fast. Electronic music.

A slightly kitsch restaurant club that plays Russian pop and is full of gold diggers, semi-pros, and men from the Caucasus republics. Thursday is the strongest night but that dynamic might be changing since Secret Room opened its doors. You can swoop here but it will be a struggle.

Mid-level: your sweet spot in terms of ease and attractiveness of girls for an average budget.

Started going downwards in 2018 due to lax face control and this might get even worse with the World Cup. In terms of layout one of the best Moscow nightclubs because it’s very big and bottle service gives you a good edge here. Still attracts lots of cute girls with loose morals but plenty of provincial girls (and guys) as well. Swooping is fairly easy here.

I haven’t been at this place in over a year, ever since it started becoming ground zero for drunken teenagers. Similar clientele to Icon but less chic, younger and drunker. Decent mainstream music that attracts plenty of tourists. Girls are easy here as well.

Sort of a Coyote Ugly (the real one in Moscow sucks) with party music and lots of drunken people licking each others’ faces. Very entertaining with the right amount of alcohol and very easy to pull in there. Don’t think about staying sober in here, you’ll hate it.

Artel Bessonitsa/Shakti Terrace

Electronic music club that is sort of a high-end place with an underground clientele and located between the teenager clubs Icon and Gipsy. Very good music but a bit all over the place with their vibe and their branding. You can swoop almost any type of girl here from high-heeled beauty to coked-up hipsters, provided they’re not too sober.

Afterparty: if by 5AM  you haven’t pulled, it’s time to move here.

Best afterparty spot in terms of trying to get girls. Pretty much no one is sober in there and savage gorilla game goes a long way. Lots of very hot and slutty-looking girls but it can be hard to tell apart who is looking for dick and who is just on drugs but not interested. If by 9-10am you haven’t pulled, it is probably better to surrender.

The hipster alternative for afterparties, where even more drugs are in play. Plenty of attractive girls there but you have to know how to work this type of club. A nicer atmosphere and better music but if you’re desperate to pull, you’ll probably go to Miks.

Weekday jokers: if you’re on the hunt for some sexy Russian girls during the week, here are two tips to make your life easier.

Chesterfield

Ladies night on Wednesdays means this place gets pretty packed with smashed teenagers and 6s and 7s. Don’t pull out the three-piece suit in here because it’s a “simpler” crowd. Definitely your best shot on Wednesdays.

If you haven’t pulled at Chesterfield, you can throw a Hail Mary and hit up Garage’s Black Music Wednesdays. Fills up really late but there are some cute Black Music groupies in here. Very small club. Thursday through Saturday they do afterparties and you have an excellent shot and swooping girls that are probably high.

Shishas Sferum

This is pretty much your only shot on Mondays and Tuesdays because they offer free or almost free drinks for women. A fairly low-class club where you should watch your drinks. As always the case in Moscow, there will be cute girls here on any day of the week but it’s nowhere near as good as on the weekend.

In a nutshell, that is all you need to know about where to meet Moscow girls in nightlife. There are tons of options, and it all depends on what best fits your style, based on the type of girls that you’re looking for.

Related Topics

• moscow girls
• moscow nightlife

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